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Maternal Side Qualification?

PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 9:55 pm
by mikevitale
This is an invaluable website and forum. Thank you for your opinions and advice:

My father is 100 % French, so I'm relying solely on my Mother's Italian Lineage:

1. Maternal Great Grandfather born in Calabria region of Italy 1878, immigrated through Ellis Island 1902, never became a U.S. citizen nor did he denounce his Italian citizenship (1930 census document as proof).
2. Maternal Grandfather born 1912 in America (never denounced his right to Italian citizenship)
3. My mother was born 1942 in America (never denounced right to Italian Citizenship)
4. I was born 1971 in America

Final questions: If I do qualify and I would like my family to apply, can I use the same primary documents for each application, or does the Italian embassy keep them for each application. Secondly, would it be easier if my mother applies first and then my family and I follow her footsteps?

Thanks for taking the time to answer.
Mike

Re: Maternal Side Qualification?

PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:14 pm
by Em
It appears that you do qualify, but the census is not acceptable as proof of non-naturalization. You will need to thoroughly search regional and federal records, and obtain "no record" letters to prove this to the satisfaction of the consulate. Once you have this documentation in hand, you are good to go, and the consulate will assume that subsequent generations did not renounce. There is a form that is to be completed for both living and deceased ascendents on which this is stated.

Your second question is more difficult to answer because the answer depends on the consulate through which you will be applying and whether you and the rest of your family live in the same jurisdication. I applied with my son, and some consulates will allow several members of the family to apply together using the same document set. This, of course, only works if you all reside in the same consular jurisdiction.

If not, the path will probably be easier if your mom applies first. You can, of course, all apply simultaneously at different consulates, but that would mean separate records for each application. The consulates generally return Italian-issued documents and Naturalization Certificates, but U.S.-issued documents are kept and are sent to your Italian comune for registration.

Re: Maternal Side Qualification?

PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 10:50 pm
by Tiffany
Adding that it is not however easier in the sense that the entire process will go faster, nor do consulates require that your mother apply first. The only savings would be in money, paper and ink - as Em outlines if you two are located in different consular regions and simultaneously apply, you will need to duplicate documentation. If she applies first, is recognized and gets her passport, you can apply as the son of a recognized Italian citizen with essentially just your birth certificate.

Re: Maternal Side Qualification?

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 1:38 am
by zagnut
If I do qualify and I would like my family to apply, can I use the same primary documents for each application, or does the Italian embassy keep them for each application.

LA consulate kept all the documents, including Italian birth certificate and certificate of naturalization from USCIS.

Re: Maternal Side Qualification?

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 7:57 am
by mikevitale
Thanks for all your replies and guidance. This website is an invaluable tool. I have to wait eight years until I'm retired from the military with my security clearance anyway. All kidding aside, it may take me that long to gather all of my documents! Ciao.

Re: Maternal Side Qualification?

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 12:03 am
by piccola_pampina
mikevitale wrote::

1. Maternal Great Grandfather born in Calabria region of Italy 1878, immigrated through Ellis Island 1902, never became a U.S. citizen nor did he denounce his Italian citizenship (1930 census document as proof).



Hi Mike! Hope I can be some help. I too have a census, however, from 1920. On the document it says that both my great great grandmother and great great grandfather naturalized in 1909. Today I received an e-mail from the NARA of no records found for his naturalization. I'm also assuming that they searched his anglicized name, but e-mailed them back a request to search for that. I would think that anything with an anglicized name would have popped up with the additional information I provided on his family. You can request such searches at: http://www.archives.gov/ . Make sure you search in the correct region of where your relative lived. I had the NARA search two separate boroughs of NY in two time periods and nothing was found. They suggested that I contact a more local office. I did, but I would think that if the federal/national archives didn't have anything that a more local office would not have it, although it's always better to check. The local office would be a county clerk that you would have to make such a request at.


Hope this helps!

Re: Maternal Side Qualification?

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2009 1:35 am
by Cynders
Hi all,

I thought I understood the process, but now I'm confused (at least I'm not the first :D ).

I qualify through both sides. I live in San Francisco. My father & sister live in Philly. We all want to apply. I believed I had to wait until my father's app was processed & his citizenship recognized *before I could even apply in SF*. Am I wrong here? Can I apply in SF and get through without my father's application being finished?

I just found out that I can also apply thorough my (deceased) mother and either her father or mother (both qualify). I'm assuming I could apply in SF right now (if I had all the docs). Am I correct?

Grazie for any clarification here!
Cinzia

Re: Maternal Side Qualification?

PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2009 9:58 am
by Em
You are correct. It is not necessary for your ascendent to apply; it's simply necessary that he be eligible. When looking at female ascendents, however, be certain that you do not run into a problem with the 1948 cut-off. Before 1/1/48, women were unable to pass on citizenship.

Also be aware that if several people are applying at different consulates, you will each need your own document set.

Re: Maternal Side Qualification?

PostPosted: Sat Aug 08, 2009 12:06 am
by Cynders
Thanks very much, Em. Boy, I wish I had known that (about the ascendant not having to apply before I do)...ah, well, it's water under the bridge now.

I was born after 1948, so that's not a problem I don't think (the date applies to me, the applicant, right?). My mother's father declared his intent to become a naturalized American citizen before my mother was born, but the process wasn't complete until a year after she was born. And it's kind of a moot point, anyway, since I can apply through my father's side too.

Now to finish rounding up the documents and translations!
cheers,
Cinzia

Re: Maternal Side Qualification?

PostPosted: Sat Aug 08, 2009 9:15 am
by Em
You seem to qualify through several lines, so there's no real problem, but I think you misunderstand the 1948 law. Yes, you can obtain citizenship from your mom because you were born after 1948, but your mom (if she was born before 1948) could only obtain citizenship through her father. The 1948 law applies at each point.

Re: Maternal Side Qualification?

PostPosted: Sun Aug 09, 2009 4:17 pm
by Cynders
Ahhh, thanks for the clarification. Yes, I was not understanding that 1948 would apply to my mom, too. So on my mom's side, since she was born before 1948, my only path would be me-mom-grandfather.

BTW, I sent an email requesting an appointment at the SF consulate and received an automated reply that the next available appointments are in April 2011. :( I'll cross-post this on the Consulates board in case anyone's interested. Cinzia